palm sanders

[Envious Interiors]

hey guys, i was reading in street rod builder that they painted a hot rod, and cleared it, then block sanded the clear, and then used a palm sander with some 4000 grit sandpaper before they buffed. i was thinking about getting one of these palm sanders, but, are they random orbital like a DA sander, or do they spin just like a buffer? i think for doing vehicles out of a garage at the moment, this would be the best way to bring back some shine and make sure i got all of the dust out. also, how do you go about shooting 5 or 6 coats of clear? do you want to spray 2, wetsand, then spray the next 2? i dont want any scratches noticable and i dont want to test the theory of mine and screw up? thanks.

 

[rex]

The sanders are DA type.I have an AirAdvantage but the Dynabraide is available with different stroke sizes and runs much smoother,I wish I paid the extra $30 for it.The best way to put clear on thick is to do it as a normal clearing and sand and reclear until you get to where you want.You can put extra coats on but it's touchy on not causing problems.To ge the maximum depth from clear you don't want to buff it out.If you sand and buff it the eye sees a nice flat finish but if oyu put it next to an identical job that wasn't buffed you'll see there's less gloss and depth on the buffed one.Spot buffing a dirt nib is prefered if you get the clear laid down nice.

 

[Envious Interiors]

so, for dust nibs, should i just buff and not wetsand? should i still wetsand and buff for flame and custom graphic jobs to get rid of the line? thanks for the help

 

[rex]

Let me do this in order instead of the order you asked.When I do grafix and will get the line I put an extra coat or 2 of clear on and then sand out the line after it's sat a few days.Then when you reclear it with another 2 coats (or 3 if it's a 3coat clear) it will lay down slick as a baby's butt.If I get a few nibs I sand them out only and buff out the scratches.I have buffed the whole part out many times but if I can preserve that original gloss I try to.Sometimes I get what I call a forced peel,you get a little heavy spraying and the clear lays out nice and sags back into a slight peel.Alot of people don't see the difference I was talking about between buffing or not because your eye sees a beautiful flat finish and the reflections trick you into thinking it's an ultra high gloss.The only way you can tell the difference is to put the 2 side by side but they have to be the same color or very close,black is a great example if you test it.This is very nit picking but I've had people notice and ask why one looked so much deeper and brilliant looking.

On clearing to level the tape edge,I'm trying a different approach on the next one.I always get a faint line after it sees a bit of sun if I use topcoat clear to block it level no matter what I try to avoid it.After hashing it over with a few guys and bitching at the rep the new plan is to use the inter clear (DBC500) with hardner throughout all the base work.I've tried it before but without the hardner and got the same faint line,but I think this will work.At least it better,it's starting to really irritate me even though the owner can't see it most of the time.If anyone knows a cure for this in PPGs DBC and Concept clears I'm still open to suggestions.Sorry for rambling again.

 

[gc]

rex,

Have you tried using an intermediate pad?

 

[rex]

Hey GC,welcome to the board.I've used one a few times and like them but I don't have one yet.They're great for finish sanding but I don't like them for leveling out tape lines,the one I used was soft so it wouldn't cut it down like a hard pad.Man,you like DAs huh

My Hutchins blew up a few weeks ago so as soon as I replace it I'm setting one up with the intermediate setup.Right now I'm down to my AirAdvantage and the BluePoint,but the BP is too aggressive for anything but stripping and bodywork.I have to replace the Hutchins because I haven't used anything I like better but I'll probably pick up a Dynabraide sometime.Is the price of these things getting rediculous or is it me?

 

[gc]

I'm glad to have found this site. Been finding some good info. Perhaps I may help someone else out too!

I agree, prices are starting to get ridiculous but since I work for a government agency (municipal) my jobber gives me the government discount also

. I save a large amount on purchases, sometimes as much as 50 percent. Besides the discount, one of my benefits is a tool allowance. If there is an item that looks promising, the shop will buy one and if I like it then I will get one for myself. We also have an independent tool guy who allows me to test drive tools before buying them. Dang, I guess one can have their cake and eat it too!

I have 2 Hutchins 6" but they are not palm sanders. I have 14 DAs total. Some were purchased new, and a few off ebay too. I got the Snap-on, a 12,000 rpm unit for $22 total. I use 2 ND 8" sanders quite regularly for hoggin paint and plastic. One is set up for Stick It and the other for Hook It II. Both are equiped for vaccuum hook up as are some of my others.

 

[gc]

In 6" sanders I have 2 Dynabrade, 2 Airvantage, 1 Snap-on, 1 Ingersoll Rand. In 3" sanders I have 1 Airvantage and 1 Dynabrade. For your money go with either the Airvantage or DynaBrade sanders. All are set up for the 3M HookIt system and I highly reccommend the use of the intermediate pad for color sanding clear. This pad will greatly aid in the removal of the paint line which should appear in the clear coat. I also finish my final primer coat with these sanders so as to have a glass smooth surface which to lay my paint on.

 

[gc]

I guess I am not completely understanding your problem with paint/tape lines. Are we talking about the extra millage of paint build up that we find at the edge of the tape/masking material? The best way I have found to reduce this is to decrease the thickness of the tape or masking material. The thickness of your tape creates a taller edge to catch and collect paint, acting like a reserior. Try shooting away from the edge if possible. This way the edge has less chance to collect paint. Paint viscosity and # of coats will play a part in this line also.

Short of a floating mask or no mask at all there will almost always be a line of some kind because there is an edge. I have heard of one guy who after removing tape/masking, hits the lines with a blender or lacquer thinner thus melting the edge away.

 

[rex]

Sounds like you have a great job.The problem I keep getting is kind of small but I haven't been able to eliminate it.After I clear and block down the edge from flames,etc and reclear it after it hits the sun a few days the edge shrinks in a little.It doesn't turn into a step like the first coat has that you level out,it's a very slight U shaped line right at the edge of the flames.You really have to look for it bit it's there and bothers me.I'm looking for another brand of fineline that's thinner than 3M blue and I really don't like their green.It seems the better tapes I find are all thick and as you said it just aggrevates the heighth of your tape edge.Using the DBC line of base doean't help but the next one will be done with the hardner added to lock it up like the DBU line.

 

[gc]

Rex,

Been thinking about this. Do you actually feel a line or simply see it? Perhaps it is an illusion or reflection created by the paint line underneath the clear. Just a thought. I wouldn't want you to go crazy chasing lines that don't exist!

They're comin' to take me away! Ah ha!